POST BBI CORSAIR FINDS AND DISCUSSION HERE

JohnLumley · Post by **JohnLumley** » Tue Aug 09, 2005 3:21 pm

Confirmed my local TRU will be getting only two this Thursday. (cough cough)

I will be coming to work late on that day.

Cheers

KAMIKAZE · Post by **KAMIKAZE** » Tue Aug 09, 2005 7:06 pm

BBI Corsairs in San Antonio sold out in one day! 12 of them at three stores. The Toy MGR said 12 more in Thursday. I will recon Corpus Christi stores this coming Saturday.

Mark

Razor17019 · Post by **Razor17019** » Tue Aug 09, 2005 8:47 pm

There are 2 in my local TRU if anyone is interested??
private mail me...

HardenSteel · Post by **HardenSteel** » Tue Aug 09, 2005 10:40 pm

Just got my BBI Corsair, the other day. Except for the landing gear which is could use larger main wheels, support struts, and a better tail hook ( re 21 Century), I think it's a major step up. However the detail around the landing gear is far superior ( none on the 21st version)

Detail for the BBI corsair overall is really improved and the weight is much lighter. The cockpit detail is particularily notable. I also like the way the wing attaches to the fuselage allowing access to the inside. All the movable surface are also most welcome. Looks great with all the flaps down. The folding joint is an improvement as well.

BBI is really giving 21st a run for the money.

This begs a question - who does the design for BBI? Does Roy do some stuff for them, as well?

Anyway, Well done BBI! Now, if they would only put out a few British tanks and the AV8-B Harrier!

Cheers,

HD

HardenSteel · Post by **HardenSteel** » Tue Aug 09, 2005 11:00 pm

Oh yeah, Found this:

<img src="http://photos.airliners.net/middle/6/6/2/658266.jpg" border="0" />

HD

Post by **p51** » Tue Aug 09, 2005 11:32 pm

Thanks for reminding me! I saw the Corsair today! It wasn't for sale, but on display at a local aviation store and got to take a close look at it. Looks not bad, love the flaps. I'm a fan of the paint job since the Marine's Dream Corsair that is in the warbird community used to be located at Planes of Fame for some time.

However, I agree that it looks a ton like the 21st Corsair... for those of you who are looking to get your bbi corsair to work with XD things it shouldn't take much effort, both are so close they also most look identical overall. I doubt Roy is working for both companies, but I do agree they look really close to eachother. Granted, Bbi has thrown in a lot of extra detail, but I'm kinda curious to see if I can interconnect the various other parts with 21st's stuff. Those who have the Corsair, can you put the horizontal stabilizers from the 21st Corsair into the BBi one?

Not sure I like the rockets though. I agree that the hook could have been much better. Now that I've seen it and how close it is to 21st corsairs, not sure I will go for this unless it's on sale somewhere since I've got 5 Corsairs already. I'm going to stop going out of my way hitting all TRUs for it. If I happen to find it, maybe... but I'd rather wait for the next F-16 release. I do, though, want to put it next to the 21st Corsair and see how close they are... I think they'll be almost idenitical minus extra detail.

Website · Post by **Teamski** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 6:22 am

Can anybody take some comparison photos of the 2 planes? I would of done this like the P-51's, but I'm not able to do it. Both Corsairs do look a lot alike. I mean, like the P-51, you would think that there would be some shape differences. But, I don't see them here except for the detailed improvements.......

-Ski

digger · Post by **digger** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 9:33 am

Ski, I don't know if you can access ebay but this auction has some good pics

http://cgi.ebay.com/LARGE-BBI-1-18-F4U- ... dZViewItem

There is another auction with some good in the box pics. The flaps and all certainly distinguish it, but it does seem VERY similar, which I guess can be expected since they're both Corsairs

But if you look at some individual parts it looks like they are interchangeable.

Post by **aferguson** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 9:51 am

New packaging looks way better. Big improvement.

MightyMustang · Post by **MightyMustang** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 10:47 am

Last night my friend who has the bbi Corsair asked me to bring over my Kepford bird just to make some comparisons and to see if I could switch parts between the two. Heres what we found:

1-The two birds are almost identicle with bbi having major improvements like detailing and so fourth. The stenciling and cockpit. engraved panel lines ect compared to my "bird" were lets just say far much better. The only thing my Corsair had better was the landing gear. It seemed much stronger then the bbi Corsair and the tires where also much better as well. The tail gear was much better on mine to.

2-Interchanging parts. My freind took the whole wing section from his bbi Corsair and fit it to mine and believe it or not it worked with little or no difference at all. In fact it looks pretty cool to have my Kepford Corsair with dropped flaps! Also you can do the same with the tail stabilizers as well for anyone interested. If you wanted to do a MAJOR overhaul on the 21st Corsair I guess you could by interchanging alot of parts by literally ripping BOTH birds apart and rebuilding the 21st Corsair from scratch by using the parts from the bbi Corsair. But with the money you spend and how good the bbi Corsair looks I dont know if you would want to do that but it would be up to you.

To sum up. The bbi Corsair is much better then the 21st Corsair hands down in my opinion. Quality wise bbi beats it in every respect except for the landing gear. They are identicle in size and shape so theres no difference there at all. I like the fact that the prop is removable on the bbi Corsair due to the fact that I can detail some of the engine if I want when I get mine. I also have decided that I'm not going to interchange the parts between the two Corsairs when I get mine due to the fact that the bbi Corsair is very nice and I dont want to waste money that I spent on buying the bbi Corsair. Now I want to make clear that I am not downing my Kepford Corsair at all with this post because the 21st Corsairs are still very nice in their own respect BUT bbi has them beat unless 21st re-tools their Corsair series which I dont think they will. If bbi keeps on releasing WW2 Fighters like their Corsair then they will be giving 21st a major run for their money.

digger · Post by **digger** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:23 am

MM wrote:

My freind took the whole wing section from his bbi Corsair and fit it to mine and believe it or not it worked with little or no difference at all. Also you can do the same with the tail stabilizers as well for anyone interested.

It's sounding more and more like bbi just used the 21st mold and added a few more details to make it their own. We've heard of smaller models being scaled up (cough, Cobra, cough....), but if Blue Box just suped up the XD bird then it is shameful.....I guess imitation is the sincerest form of flattery

Anyway, something smells in toyland....

KAGNEW · Post by **KAGNEW** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:41 am

IF 21st & BBI did there home work on a real Corsair then the models should be real close.
if you look at pix of old WWII factorys the models are put together a lot like the real thing.
so it is not suprizing to me that part would be interchangable.
in fact the people who build models sometimes use several differant companys kits to make a model. we call it kitbashing

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 12:52 pm

Found these at the TRU in Clovis, Ca. None at the store in Fresno. Good looking plane, but its too similar to the 21c Corsair (albeit the moving flaps and rockets) to warrant another purchase.

There were no BBI paratroopers, however

MightyMustang · Post by **MightyMustang** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 1:08 pm

tmanthegreat,

I felt like you before I saw the bbi Corsair up close and personal. I wasnt going to get "another" Corsair because I felt that my Kepford bird was good enough. But what changed my mind was the features bbi's Corsair offered and the detailing. For me that was enough to where I couldnt pass on it and thanks to a member on here I will have a chance to get one.

Post by **p51** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 5:46 pm

Wow! That interchangable huh MightyMustang?? I figured they may lock in pretty good, but that's definitely interesting that it's almost a perfect fit. I agree with Digger... sounds like there may be something up here. Granted, I understand what KAGNEW means, but the various parts shouldn't be interchangable... I mean if there were enough imporvements then they should be different. The fact they are so simular tells me they may have started with the Corsair mold from 21st and gone from there as Digger brought up.

OnWu · Post by **OnWu** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 5:56 pm

The fact they are so simular tells me they may have started with the Corsair mold from 21st and gone from there as Digger brought up.

This is purely conjecture but I wouldn't put it past my Chinese brothers. Business "Ethics" is much, much different over there than it is in America. Chinese knockoffs of music and software are legendary, for instance, and this activity is seen as perfectly legitimate in Asia.

Post by **aferguson** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 6:02 pm

Mike wrote:

"for digger and others

Now come on guys...there is no possibility of us using another company's tooling for our products. Manufacturing just does not work that way...look on the belly of the Corsair to see our mark...no-one else's.

Since both 21C and Elite Force Corsairs are a real 1:18 scale then they should be the same size...surely that is logical.
As for the construction method..most industries have standard construction techniques...do you think that Chevrolet and Ford are so different in the manufacturing process?"

KAGNEW · Post by **KAGNEW** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 6:21 pm

reverse engineering is most the likely answer, like the USSR with the B-29 after the war.
there not using reworked 21st molds
because the molds at 21st are still being used as the Pappy F4U is on way .so not a direct copy or mold modifing . but i still want to think it is a engineering thing more then a copy.
i want to see new 21st P-51D. maybe they work closer than we know
i wish they would do different stuff then rehash the other guys.how many mustangs and corsairs can we buy

KAGNEW · Post by **KAGNEW** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 6:34 pm

that brings up a good point
when i was in Vietnam you cold go to Siagon and see the front of a 55 Chevy welded to the back of a 53 Ford. they just made it work out of necessity. wasn't any copying. just the way they made do and how close engineering was even back then

digger · Post by **digger** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 7:09 pm

Since both 21C and Elite Force Corsairs are a real 1:18 scale then they should be the same size...surely that is logical.
As for the construction method..most industries have standard construction techniques...do you think that Chevrolet and Ford are so different in the manufacturing process

Agreed on both fronts.....I guess it's just same size, built the same way, pieces are interchangeable - they are just very similar, that's all. I shouldn't have said "same mold"

MightyMustang · Post by **MightyMustang** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:22 pm

aferguson wrote:Mike wrote:

"for digger and others

Now come on guys...there is no possibility of us using another company's tooling for our products. Manufacturing just does not work that way...look on the belly of the Corsair to see our mark...no-one else's.

Since both 21C and Elite Force Corsairs are a real 1:18 scale then they should be the same size...surely that is logical.
As for the construction method..most industries have standard construction techniques...do you think that Chevrolet and Ford are so different in the manufacturing process?"

I agree with Mike here. I dont think bbi has to steal anything from 21st mold wise and to think they would is just plain wrong in my book. There are major differences in the bbi Corsair molds and 21st Corsair molds and one look and you can see it. And diggers comment about "same mold" was taken the wrong way, I knew what he meant.

So digger dont feel that you said anything wrong because you didnt.

HardenSteel · Post by **HardenSteel** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 10:25 pm

I have both Corsairs and because they are both 1/18 scale and are the same plane- they should look the same. But they don't. There is a world of difference between the series 2 - 21 Century Corsair and the latest series by BBI. It's comparing toys to models. Just like the BBI Mustang is far ahead of the 21st version ( not counting the newest version. of course). BBI is the hands down winner. You can expect the new
Legend series from 21st to be very competative - thier first announced release - retooled corsair?

However, if you compare the latest version 21 Century releases like the Spitfire , or Starfighter to the BBI Corsair or F16 - now you have a tough desicion to make.

I did not pick out every little thing that I though was better, but if you look through all the posts, it is considerable. The nose area of the BBI appears to be a bit smaller as well - I should just measure it.

It's clear when the 2 Corsairs are side by side that they are very different molds - even the method of fastening the main part of the wing to the fuselage is quite different. You would expect the wing ends to be the same because that the way they are.

I can't see why you would want to switch wing ends anyway. Half the movable flaps are on the main part.

I would like to note that I am a huge fan of both companies. We are comparing different generations of product and you can rightly expect the latest generation is better.

That was one of the things we hoped for in the early days of collecting this stuff - good productive competiton - leads to better products from both
companies. Recall the BBI - 6 wheel Piranha - it's very poorly done - should be retooled & re released - also an early release.

However, the latest stuff is so good - what I want to know is who does this at BBI? Kudos!

Cheers,

HD

digger · Post by **digger** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 4:01 am

Recall the BBI - 6 wheel Piranha - it's very poorly done - should be retooled & re released - also an early release.

8

Post by **aferguson** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 5:02 am

Mike wrote:

"For HardenSteel

thanks for your views on the Corsair...as for "who does this at bbi"...we have a team and they are very good and getting better...and I will [pass your compliments on to them and yes the 6 wheel Piranha should have been better...we are learning every day."

MightyMustang · Post by **MightyMustang** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 9:40 am

I just wanted to put this email I got here. I came from the owner of the "Marines Dream" website:

Thanks for your nice comments about our website. It's obviously a work in progress! Yes, I know about the models. Marines Dream is painted to represent the Corsair flown by Ken Walsh in 1943. This scheme was selected at the time of restoration because Ken Walsh was the first Corsair ace. He was flying with VMF-124.

Terry

Its nice to know that bbi's version of the F4U they did represents a Corsair flown by Maj Walsh who was the first Corsair Ace and a Medal Of Honor winner. The "Marines Dream" website tells about the restoration of the Corsair and has photos of the plane and so fourth. Its a new website and they are just getting started on it with more to come. If anyone is interested about the site let me know.

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